This article is about my experience with Costco’s purported lifetime return policy. But first let’s review. Last week Michael published an article about how he stole $45 from Costco. He felt terrible about what he had done and wanted readers’ views on the situation. Most people felt he did the wrong thing, myself included. But what was particularly surprising to me was the venom in a few of the comments. Here are two examples:
Coward. I am unsubscribing from your blog because I will not seek financial advice from someone of questionable character. That’s what this is about. Not $45. Not whether or not Costco will miss the money. Not to whom you should donate the money to atone for your misdeed. Not how lucky you are for this “found” money. Knowing the truth, you intentionally deceived Costco in order to avoid paying for those goods. That was the point that you crossed the line. You can still make things right, but you are choosing not to do so because you are embarrassed. Your principles are compromised. . . . May the dishonesty you’ve demonstrated be returned upon you 1,000 times. Coward.
As a senior manager it is very depressing to see your lack of anonymity towards the cashier and member service employee you embarrassed. I can not immagine how they must feel. The sad part is you knowingly walked out with unpaid merchandise and failed to make it right. To make matters worse we know who you are Every time you shop your card will be flagged (beware of possible theft). At no point will you be approached. Yet, we will be watching you from this point forward no matter which Costco you shop. Thnak you for the heads up XXXXX
So if a $45 error gets people this upset at Michael, then the story I’m about to tell will really upset them.
Costco’s Lifetime Return Policy
A little over two years ago we bought our son an electric piano from Costco. It cost about $1,300. Earlier this year he told me he wanted a different piano, and he asked if he could return the piano to Costco and buy a new one. When I explained that it had been nearly two years since we bought the piano from Costco, he told me they have a lifetime return policy. To be honest, I didn’t believe him.
So I called Costco. Sure enough, with some exceptions Costco has a lifetime return guarantee. At least that’s what the Costco representative told me on the phone. So I went to costco.com to check out the return policy, and here’s what it says:
Merchandise: We guarantee your satisfaction on every product we sell with a full refund. The following must be returned within 90 days of purchase for a refund: televisions, projectors, computers, cameras, camcorders, iPOD / MP3 players and cellular phones.
Sure enough, there is no time limit on returns except for a few electronics listed above. So the next day I called back to start the return process. The Costco representative pulled up my purchase, confirmed that it was eligible for return, and told me somebody would contact me in the next 7 to 10 days to schedule a pickup of the piano. Later that day we ordered his new electric piano from Amazon.
And then I received the following e-mail:
Costco is dedicated to offering the best products at the best prices to our members. We recognize that in rare instances there are defects in products that we sell, or a member may decide that they purchased the wrong item for their needs. Our return policy is the most lenient in the marketplace to accommodate our members in these instances. Several conditions are evaluated when considering a return of purchase; reason for return, membership history, return history, date of purchase and price of purchase.
Recently, you contacted us to request a return for the item listed above. We make every effort to accommodate the needs of our members, however based on your original purchase date and the reasons listed above, we will be unable to honor this request.
Sincerely,
COSTCO WHOLESALE
I’ve left out the name of the Costco representative who signed the e-mail. The most interesting part of this e-mail is the following: “Several conditions are evaluated when considering a return of purchase; reason for return, membership history, return history, date of purchase and price of purchase.” Compare that sentence to Costco’s return policy and you’ll see a stark difference. I guess they tell you one thing when you are buying stuff from them and another thing when you are returning stuff to them.
Quite annoyingly, no phone number was included in the e-mail so I have no way of calling the person who sent the message. So instead I call back the number used for returns. The Costco representative tells me that returns older than 2 years are not accepted. I pointed out that (1) that’s not what I was told when I first called to inquire about Costco’s return policy, (2) that’s not what I was told when the representative processed my return, (3) that’s not what Costco’s return policy says, and (4) the piano was purchased less than two years ago (by just a few days).
She had no response and told me my only recourse was to respond to the e-mail Costco had sent me. So I replied to the e-mail six days ago. So far I’ve received no response.
Now, it seems utterly crazy that a company would have a lifetime return policy. But with a few exceptions, that’s the business policy Costco has decided to adopt. It no doubt is part of a business strategy that is very consumer friendly. But when you don’t honor your own policy, what started out as consumer-friendly becomes just the opposite.
So my question is simple–what should I do?
Rob Berger
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Published or updated August 8, 2010.
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Call Corporate offices.
I find this post very disturbing. You *know* that returning the piano that your son has gotten two years’ worth of use out of is ethically wrong, but you’re justifying your (attempted) actions based on a loophole in Costco’s generous returns policy. Essentially, you’re saying that it’s Costco’s responsibility to ensure that its customers behave ethically — and the only way to do so is by creating a new strict returns policy that punishes other (ethical) users. You’re actually asking for assistance on how to abuse the existing policy successfully?
If your son’s piano had stopped working after 6 months, Costco (unlike every other business) would have taken it back. They do this because they stand behind their products and it’s part of the reason why I love Costco. It’s not a no-interest, no-charge lease program so that spoiled teens and their contemptible parents can have the latest in musical instruments, sofas, bicycles, golf clubs, etc. Bravo, Costco, for turning you down.
Jenny, I don’t think it’s ethically wrong or a loophole. It’s Costco’s policy, and its prices undoubtedly reflect the cost of that policy. Costco could very easily change the lifetime policy to apply only to products that break, but they haven’t done that. In fact, what I find ethically wrong is a company that publishes a lifetime return policy but then refuses to honor it.
Sorry, DR, but I have to agree with Rebecca’s post below (much better worded than my own). Your argument that Costco’s prices are reflected in the policy is specious. If every Costco member acted as you are trying to, the business would fold in weeks. Costco treats its employees well, sells quality products at reasonable prices, and generally tries not to be evil (see this article for details: http://abcnews.go.com/2020/Business/story?id=1362779).
Are you hoping to see the returns policy changed? I think Costco SHOULD be allowed to make a judgment call about whether or not returns are valid — it has a well-earned reputation for accepting returned merchandise, but that’s no reason to treat them like suckers. I think you know that you are violating the spirit of the returns policy — you wouldn’t be incredulous that the policy exists otherwise.
I remain disturbed that you don’t find it ethically wrong to ask a retailer to absorb the cost of a luxury item because your family got bored of it.
No offense, but the suggestion that this return is ethically wrong is ridiculous! The OP was honest from the beginning about his purchases, and 100% honest when he contacted Costco about the return. He never misled them about anything.
Costco themselves decided to develop a lifetime return policy. They are not required to do that. But if they do, then they are legally and morally required to honor it. It is fraudulent for them to advertise a “lifetime return” policy with no intention of honoring it except for customers who have a certain “membership history” with them.
You can return any item bought in store or online at any Costco at any time you are unsatisfied. With the exception of electronics.
Um, that’s not what they said:
“Merchandise: We guarantee your satisfaction on every product we sell with a full refund. The following must be returned within 90 days of purchase for a refund: televisions, projectors, computers, cameras, camcorders, iPOD / MP3 players and cellular phones.”
A piano does not fall under any of “the following”.
You should not attempt to return it after two years. If your son was going to keep it, and it was defective, that would be a different story. But you are just getting a different piano after two years of having the old one, which STILL WORKS. It is unethical to return it at this point.
As I noted above, I don’t see anything unethical here at all. I do find Costco’s stated return policy very surprising. But what is unethical about (1) telling Costco upfront exactly why we are returning the piano (which we did), and (2) expecting Costco to live up to its published return policy?
I don’t think the reasoning “because I want a different ‘insert name of item here’ after two years” is valid. It would be different if the piano didn’t work correctly. It does. Where do you draw the line?
If I bought an LCD TV two years ago, and now a 1080P version of the same TV is available with new features, should Costco (or any other company) take back my two year old TV, which I’ve used extensively, and replace it with a new model? The answer is no. Based on this business model, no company could stay in business very long.
Returns cost money. If an item is defective, Costco can charge back the original supplier and recoup some or all of the original wholesale cost. If not, the original supplier may not allow credit to Costco, so essentially Costco has sold two units for the price of one.
Yes, Costco’s written policy technically allows for this return. However, in the spirit of fairness to the retailer, did it really take 2 years for you to be unsatisfied? Or is it just a case of wanting the latest and greatest, and not wanting to pay for it?
Why shouldn’t the onus be on Costco to clearly specify the rules up front about when returns are and are not allowed? Every other retailer in the business specifies these rules without a problem. Why should Costco alone be allowed to advertise to customers that they offer “lifetime returns” when they really only mean returns under certain circumstances?
I just don’t see why Costco can’t have a standard return policy with set time limits like every other retailer has.
I would say Costco has every right to disallow the return of this item. Moreover, I’m surprised DR considers his actions ethical behavior. The item functioned as expected for two years and now can be resold as used to someone who will appreciate it. It shouldn’t be Costco’s responsibility to finance a buyer’s regret or need to upgrade. Returning items and forcing a company to eat the cost only results in a company raising prices on new items for others and for yourself.
Based on this article and the previous one where the author was aware he had stolen, I too will be unsubscribing from the RSS feed to DoughRoller. While we all want be money wise, we also want to be financially ethical. If the best advice offered here is illegal and unethical, I’m happy to move on. I can only hope DR’s self-serving behaviors do not spread, as soon we will all be paying a premium for the five-fingered discounts such people feel they deserve.
Absolutely agreed. Count me among the newly unsubscribed.
Heh, I’m sorry, Leigh, but can I unsubscribe to your comments? There is a huge difference between literally stealing an item from Costco and asking them to honor a policy that they themselves promulgated. Maybe they think that lifetime returns generate more customer loyalty than the cost of the occasional return of a long-ago purchased item. That’s their business decision to make.
If they think that’s too costly, here’s a simple solution: DON’T OFFER A LIFETIME RETURN POLICY. Specify simple time limits like every other retailer in the market does. If they want to make occasional exceptions just for people who are a few days over the time limits, that’s fine too. They just shouldn’t mislead people into thinking they offer lifetime returns if they don’t really want to do that.
By the way, you say, “the best advice offer here is illegal.” I don’t think you have any basis whatsoever for claiming that anything the OP did here was illegal.
DR, I’m disappointed.
Not in your article, or in your decision, rather the second failed attempt to discuss business ethics and morals. The comments left for my article may be slightly more “venomous” but give it time.
That said, I don’t understand why Costco would create a policy like this, then not honor it. It would annoy me even more to have scheduled a pick-up, only to receive an email as vague as the one you have.
Unfortunately, I’m not sure what can be done from this point on. Yes, the business return policy is flawed and I would feel slighted but you have to pick your battles and considering the use you’ve already received out of this piano, and that it works, I would considering selling it yourself rather than a continued effort to return it.
What disturbs me is something no one has mentioned yet. What are you teaching your son? You’re teaching him that he can have whatever he wants because he becomes bored with something else. Whether it is worded properly or not, you know that’s not the spirit in which Costco’s policy was written. You should also consider that if many more people like you tried to return things that weren’t really defective, for which they can’t get a refund from the manufacturer, you can bet that some employee will lose his job in order to make up for the money they are losing by processing bogus returns. Is that okay? That because your kid was bored with his “toy” someone will lose his job and his own kid will go without? That is very NOT okay. Also what you’ve done is now spread this to all your readers, so the not-so-ethical readers, and perhaps their non-ethical acquaintances will try and do the same thing. Thanks for that, too. I am very disappointed in these past few blog topics. What’s going on with you people?
Wow, stumbled onto this blog by mistake, and will certainly not read it again! It’s questionable morals like this that make children think it’s ok to steal…your seriously that close to crossing the line! And the sad part is you can’t even see it! I will continue to support Costco in it’s efforts to take back BROKEN or DEFECTIVE items and not just items some people have gotten BORED with, please! I am so sorry for you that you don’t see the difference.
Talk about ethically challenged— I can’t imagine even considering returning a working 2 year old product for my own convenience. No wonder so many retailers have return policies so convoluted that it takes a lawyer to understand them. It’s people like YOU!
Wow! I must confess I’m surprised by many of these comments. Let me respond to some of the points being raised:
1. Why did we want to return the piano? Many have assumed we wanted to return the piano because my son was “bored” with it or just for our “convenience.” I’m not sure why some have reached this conclusion; the article doesn’t really say why we wanted to return it. I left that out of the article because under Costco’s return policy, it doesn’t matter. For what it’s worth, the reason was because while the piano is supposed to be able to connect to a computer, it is incompatible with Apple computers and PCs running the latest version of Windows. I’m not sure this will change the views already expressed, but I wanted to set the record straight. Of course, that raises the question of why we didn’t try to return the piano sooner. The answer to that question would fill another entire article, but part of the answer is because we didn’t learn of Costco’s lifetime return policy until about a year after we purchased the piano. And that leads me to the next point.
2. Costco’s lifetime return policy. About 1 year after we bought the piano, my wife and son were at Costco and a Costco employee was playing a grand piano to promote the pianos. She let my son play for a few minutes, and then asked my wife if she was interested in buying one of the very expensive grand pianos. My wife explained that we had already bought a Costco piano about a year earlier. In response, the Costco employee said that Costco has a no-questions-asked lifetime return policy. We could return the piano, get the cash, and apply it to a new grand piano. That’s how my son first learned of the return policy.
3. What if everybody returned items after 2 years. Several comments suggested that Costco would be out of business if everybody did what we tried to do. I think this is a fair point, but we need to look at a complete picture, not just one transaction. If everybody did what we do, that means they would spend thousands of dollars every year (car tires, food, tools, paper products, etc.) at Costco and hardly ever return anything. In fact, I don’t recall ever returning anything to Costco except this piano, and we haven’t even successfully returned it.
4. What am I teaching my son? This is another great point, and something my wife and I struggled with. We’ve talked about this as a family, and not all of us have the same view. In the end, we concluded that we would call Costco and if they returned the piano, great. And if not, we’d let it go. They said they would accept the return, we bought the new piano, and you know the rest of the story.
5. I’m not at all surprised by the comments stating that we shouldn’t try to return an item after two years. We struggled with that question. But what does surprise me is that nobody is frustrated with (1) Costco’s acceptance of the return followed by an e-mail rejecting the return, or (2) that Costco won’t abide by its own published return policy. Doesn’t it upset anybody that Costco’s published policy is unlimited (with some exceptions), but that they won’t actually live up to this policy that they wrote?
6. Finally, a number of comments have stated that they will unsubscribe or stop reading this blog because of this post. One thing I value here is the expression of divergent views. So long as comments are respectful of other viewpoints, I keep them up even if they disagree with my views. I could have easily deleted those comments, but I never do. For those that want to unsubscribe, a respect your conviction and wish you well.
DR,
First off, wonderful blog and I think it’s too bad that some people want to unsubscribe just because they disagree with you. Part of learning and interacting is dealing with opinions different than your own and how can you do that if you run away every time you disagree with something? You gotta be informed on both sides of an issue to make the best decision. I don’t always agree with you (heck, I don’t always agree with my wife) but I’m not gonna just unsubscribe from your blog or ignore my wife…neither would help the situation.
As to the ethical issues with returning the piano these are my thoughts. Costco has a lifetime return policy as stated on their website as well as by a number of employees, they should honor it. If it is such an issue with people returning stuff that they are losing money I am sure Costco will change their policy, companies are all about the money, if the return policy is bad for business I am sure they would change it but until they do they should honor it.
For you personally I think that if you can return the piano and not feel guilty and are able to sleep at night go for it.
As a side note you say the computer does not work with the recent new operating systems released for both Mac and Windows. Have you tried contacting the piano manufacturer to see if there is maybe a software up date or a patch? I don’t know how the piano works but if you install software on your computer to interface with it that may be an option.
Mark, good point on contacting the manufacturer. We didn’t do that, and at this point, I think it’s water under the bridge. We did review the manual and get online for information on new drivers, which they didn’t have.
DR,
I agree with you that Costco should honor your return. After all their return policy is a contract between customers and them. They cannot leave it up to store descretion- that’s an absurd! All other stores have clear return policy, usually written on their receipts. Costco does not have it on the receipts and did not inform about the change (up to the store manager). They informed about the 90-day electronics retun policy change so why didn’t they tell about the new store discretion thing???I wanted to return rose bushes today after 2 years. They said that they accept plants up to 1 year. Nobody inform me about that change. The roses were terrible in the first year but I postponed the return keeping in mind the lifetime satistaction crap policy. You can return plants at Home Depot or at Lowe’s within 1 year, too! They said they base their decision on a reasoning. Hey! Everyone has different reasoning, it’s very subjective. It’s ok if they change policy but they need to communicate it with the public, and accept items bought on the old terms. Changing return policy like that seems unlawful. I am thinking about filing a case againts them. They attracted all customers thanks to their lifetime policy, they used it as a bite and now they’re backing away. Anyone can make any contract as long as both parties agree to it.( even if it sounds unreasonably or silly like the lifetime satisfaction…) The contract was that we can return items with no time restriction. Now they broke the contract. That’s unfair and unlawful. Dr, if you want we could file a claim together?
thanks
DR, I agree that it is customers such as you that cause customer-friendly companies to amend their policies to deal with the unscrupulous consumers. When a company offers ‘your satisfaction guaranteed or double your money back’, there is a segment of the population who could be totally satisfied with the product but will still try to get double their money back. What is Costco to do with an electric piano that is two years old, used, and apparently outdated? I assume it still works with the exception of not being compatible with the operating system you are using on your computers. I have sat here for quite a while trying to take your side in this debate and I can’t. I’m sorry. You and your co-worker who stole, yes I believe he stole, from Costco should join BJs or Sam’s Club. Maybe they will be more to your liking. Please leave Costco alone. They are fair, reasonably priced, and customer-friendly. I’d hate either of you to change that because your moral compasses are broken.
Annie, what confuses me here is what is the point of a lifetime return policy? If you think returning something after 2 years is wrong, why does Costco have such a policy, and why do its employees promote the policy? They could limit the policy just to defective products, but they’ve chosen not to. What if we returned the piano after 18 months? 12 months? 6 months? At what point should we say sure they have a lifetime return policy, but after X months it’s just not right to take advantage of it? How many months is too many?
CASE#1
I do think that walking out with stuff you knew you didn’t pay for is theft. I expect the cashier not to screw me and give me the advertised price, the shelf price, or the “full moon on sale” price. By the same token, taking advantage of a blunder is immoral. And, there is the law of Karma to deal with. Can’t cheat an honest man. Everything evens up in the end.
CASE#2
imho, if the policy is “lifetime for any reason”, then they should honor it. By the same token, I personally would not abuse their generous terms. I think that they can’t have it both ways — one policy on sale and a more restrictive one when you try to use it. Clearly, they need to “tune up” their policy.
Case #1, the Customer is wrong. Case #2, the Customer is right.
After reading all of these posts, I would like to add my 2 cents.
1) After reading the return policy that was copied and pasted above, I fail to read anything that states there is a “LIFETIME RETURN POLICY”. I believe it states the guarantee satisfaction with a refund. It seems as though in this case that the consumer was “Satisfied” with the product for 2 years therefore I believe Costco has held up their end of the transaction.
2) As with any company I would think that Costco has a right (and frankly a duty) to be able to review any and all returns and practice reasonable discretion upon them. Wanting to return a product for these reasons after this amount of time seems to me to be unreasonable, and I believe that the email that was sent to the consumer reflects that.
Seems pretty black and white.
Interesting debate. I too made a return to Costco after an extended period, and I did wrestle with it a little. Several years ago I was going through a difficult divorce, and I had just bought a new place. I needed a vacuum, and I bought one of those expensive Dyson vacuums at Costco (about $500). I got buyers remorse about spending $500 on a vacuum the minute I got it home, before I even took it out of the box. I decided to get a much less expensive vacuum at Walmart, and my intention was to return the Dyson to Costco. Again, I never even took it out of the box or used it once. The bottom line is that I had boxes everywhere, so I moved the Dyson into a storage room to get it out of the way, again, fully intending to return it within a few days. You can probably see where this is heading…….I moved some boxes into the storage room, it covered up the vacuum cleaner, and I forgot about it. It wasn’t that I didn’t need the $500 back, I just had so much going on in my life with the divorce that I forgot about it! It wasn’t until I was moving out of that house into another that found the Dyson again. It was almost 4 years later! I called Costco, and they said they would take it back, and they did!
If I had used the vacuum, or just grown tired of it, or just wanted the latest model, I wouldn’t have even considered returning it. I have bought literally tens of thousands of dollars of merchandise from Costco over the years, and I have never returned a used item because I wanted something different or better. This was unused, and still in the sealed box. I thought about it for a little bit, but then I figured that if this wasn’t a case where the lifetime return policy was justified, what was?
The real issue from an ethical point of view is whether or not your two years of use of the product constituted your “satisfaction,” which is Costco’s implicitly stated objective in their return policy. As mentioned previously, Costco doesn’t mention or advertise a “lifetime return” policy. That’s your (and your son’s) interpretation.
Clearly, the fact that you kept the product for two years and used it throughout that time indicates that you were satisfied with your purchase, which is all that Costco’s return policy guarantees you.
I find it humorous that you employ such a clearly unethical approach to questioning Costco’s ethics.
Smitty, let’s make sure we have our facts straight. The lifetime return policy was NOT my interpretation. As noted in the article and comments, a Costco employee first alerted us to the lifetime return policy when she encouraged us to take advantage of it to buy a more expensive piano about a year after our purchase. When I called Costco to see if they would take the piano back, Costco confirmed the lifetime return policy. When I then called the next day to initiate the return, they again confirmed the policy and accepted the return. It was only after a bought a new piano the next day that they contacted me to refuse the return. So this wasn’t my interpretation, it was Costco’s.
I would hazard to say she wasnt an employ of costco. Costco routinely has roadshows with people from other companies showcasing their items in order to garner a larger customer base. They would not fully understand the policy and may have misspoke, basing your grievance off of such is no way to make your case imho
I was reading this post and agree that there is no ethical issue here.
However, Costco has stated a time limit on certain electronics ie tv computer ipod cell phones ect. which is 90 days. Everything else would be under there original return policy which had no indication of a time limit. This is a good advertising stategy and is what the membership fee is for. As a member your entitled to perks you wouldnt get anywhere else. The fee for membership is the key here. Sounds like an insurance agreement/contract as long a the dues are paid.
I think that there is absolutely an ethical issue here, no matter how the author tries to justify otherwise. But at the same time, if the author wants to return the item, Costco should honor their policy, no matter how they try to justify otherwise.
these arguments made me think of our financial crisis and how we did not let the big banks fail but kept giving them tax payers money eventually in vain. when the banks made the decision to partake in something risky, they ended up not having to face the consequence. costco chose to advertise its lifetime satisfaction guarantee return policy, yet when it did not want to stick with that policy, people chose to side with costco so that costco didn’t have to face the consequence of it’s own policy. this is like these days when all the banks let home buyers apply for additional mortgages even though the buyers may have shady credit history. the banks did not care. they just wanted to make the money out of the customers. now if you are the moral buyer will you, after you have been spending your own salary on mortgage payment for the last six months for a house that had severely depreciated recently, you are not having enough to feed your kids, but will you choose to foreclose your house? if you do, it would mean you have had lived there for free for the last few years! and if you do, whose fault is it that the bank will end up with a house that had been used? is it the bank’s fault? or is it your fault? rules are rules. policies are policies. if companies are allowed to not follow policies set by themselves, what trust can we still have in those companies?
I’d like to respond to the author of the post as well as those who believe that what he did was “ethical” because it didn’t actually violate Costco’s return policy. I am concerned that so many of you don’t seem to understand the concept of ethics. Ethical behavior has nothing to do with laws or rules or policies but is rather based on the principles or morality and pertains to right or wrong conduct. Trying to return an item after using it for two years is conduct that is ethically wrong, regardless of Costco’s return policy.
Where are Costco’s ethics when they steal billions of dollars in sales from other retailers using a return policy that they do not honor.
I smell CLASS ACTION!
Put that in your scrapbook and pass it on…
Class Action is what this is calling for. Many people are questing author, but they don’t seem to understand how much business this “liberal” return policy got for Costco. Costco could have added a simple timelimit (like a year or two year) to their policy. But they consciously (and deceptively) choose not to do so to give false sense of satisfaction to the customers. Then instead of corporate office put anything in writing, they always leave it to “Store” personnel. Thats a sneaky way of having a cake and eating it too. I bet there are informal (or internal) policies restricting “Store” personnel from accepting returns over certain value or certain time period. Its time someone file class action and call their deception.
I agree with you Jack. I’ve also had trouble returning items to Costco, who doesn’t honor their return policy and they do try to have their cake and eat it too. Class action lawsuit against Costco should be brought forth and I’ll be the first one to join. Here is what Costco should do: put a time limit and/or a price limit on their policy or simply state exactly how they currently accept returns: on a case by case basis!
I have been consistently bullied by Costco because I have taken them up over the past few decades on their return policy. Anyone remember PriceClub when you had to own a business to shop there? They wanted to expand to the general public to generate more revenue, obviously, and their expanse from business owners to general public has proved their plan corrupt. They are not honoring the words legally binding them to their customers and there should be a class action. So how can we begin?
If Costco has a policy they should abide by it. They no doubt aren’t stupid and their legal department approved this “vision” of customer satisfaction. In addition they realize that such liberal caveat would bring in more customers who would spend freely and not take the time to return things. They are undoubtedly unethical to refuse anyone who takes them up on their very well-thought out return policy. They are a retailer who charges a membership in order to shop. They aren’t always as competitive as they’d like you to think, and as time’s gone by their deals are hardly worth buying in bulk anyway. Make sure Corporate returns the piano for you, and then go ahead and suggest they stop trying to suck you into false promises. Any ethical retailer wouldn’t lie to you like Costco does.
This post dates to August 8th. It would be great to see a follow up from DR. What actually is costco’s return policy? Can you escalate the service request?
For instance, I’d like to buy a roomba from there but they tend to break and the batteries tend to die after a couple years. Is that covered? I have no idea.
I’m amazed by the people that are pinning morality issues on DR for trying to get costco to honor their stated policies. I agree their policy is too generous, but instead of arbitrarily backing out of it they should get one of their legion of lawyers to write out what the real policy is. They are a huge corporation, not some mom and pop shop, and the piano return was rejected as part of some internal return assessment procedure that they just haven’t made public for some reason. They should make that procedure public.
Eric, the piano still sits in my house. When I call Costco, the representative tells me I need to reply to the email I received denying the return. I reply and reply and Costco just ignores it. I could of course escalate this matter, but haven’t done so. Frankly, I’m more disappointed in how Costco handled this matter (encouraging me to return it, telling me I can, and then denying the return and not responding to inquiries), than I am in Costco’s refusal to honor its return policy. As for future purchases, I have no idea what Costco’s real return policy is. We all know what they say it is, but that apparently doesn’t mean much.
I had some unpleasant experiences in returning stuff to Costco too. I think Costco may be liable for advertisement fraud. They clearly advertise in their return policy that customers can return whenever they want. This gives Costco a competitive edge over their competitors. If it was not for the worry free return policy, I would have bought them from elsewhere with a better price. But they refused to honor their return policy later. I call this false advertisements.
I buy my clothes from LLBean because they guarantee lifetime satisfaction too. I returned after many months clothes the ripped, and clothes I used but did not like. They refunded no questions asked. I did discard two pairs of cheap LLBean shoes that ripped in one year instead of returning them. Currently I wear two pairs of expensive shoes from LLBean, and I will return them if they don’t last at least five years! If LLBean ever fails me in their return policy, I will cancel their card and shop where they don’t pretend to anything. But I trust LLBean is better than Costco in this respect! Any problems with returns at LLBean?
Yes they do, hypothetically. I’ve worked there for almost six years and you would be amazed at what people return. Half eaten cakes, rusty grills, dirty refrigerators, etc. Before they changed the return policy on TV’s in (I believe) 2007, there were people bringing back TVs that were 5 years old and just upgrading it. Costco does guarantee everything including your membership. However, the warehouse manager has the right to make the call based on the situation. If it looks like your working the system, they may deny it. You may have spoken to a membership employee first and then called back and got a manager. I would call a corporate number, or right an email. You will probably get a positive response from that. We had a lady get mad over a meat lovers pizza not having enough meat, and was not happy with the way the warehouse manager dealt with it and so she called corporate and got 3 free meat lover pizzas that they had to put triple toppings on. We don’t offer warranties on pianos because of our return policy, you should be able to do the return. But if you called up there saying you just want to upgrade it, then I can see why they said no. If you were to have a crack in one of the legs or it were to happen to break, it would be a different story. Good luck in your quest! Don’t let this ruin your Costco experience, it really is a wonderful company!
Costco needs to specify exactly what their return policy is like any other store. If it is 1 year then they NEED to write down it is 1 year. Right now they are saying there is a lifetime satisfaction guarantee but they do not mention this is up to interpretation. I hope an attorney challenges Costco on their false advertising!
The policy states: “We guarantee your satisfaction on every product we sell with a full refund” No time limit is implied, but nether is the term “lifetime” used. Your satisfaction was established well within the two years that you used the product. It is well within their rights to determine when a customer is abusing the return policy. Sad to see people like you want to ruin a legitamitly excellent return policy. This type of abuse is what led to the 90 day return policy on the other electronics.
”
Dear Ruben,
Thank you for your e-mail to Costco Wholesale. All orders or items over two years old is up to the discretion of the warehouse or online Returns department. Since these orders are past the 2 year time frame they would be denied.
Thank you,
Tryfena
Costco Wholesale Corporation
”
Date: 12-29-2010
Karma, KARMA
(assuming you re in CA) Cal State law requires retailers to post a copy of any return policy, in it’s entirety, at a location within the store that is in public view. The in-store posting states: ” We guarantee your satisfaction on every product we sell with a full refund…”. On-line the identical language is used, and on the page where you are sent to when clicking the “for more information about returns-click here” button they further state:
“How do I return an item?
For an immediate refund (including shipping and handling), Costco.com offers convenient returns at any one of our Costco warehouses worldwide. To expedite the return process, please have your order confirmation email with you. Click here to find the Costco warehouse closest to you.
If you are unable to return your order at one of our warehouses, please contact us at customer service or call our customer service center at 1-800-955-2292 for assistance. To expedite the processing of your return, please reference your order number.
We guarantee your satisfaction on every product we sell with a full refund. The following must be returned within 90 days of purchase for a refund: televisions, projectors, computers, cameras, camcorders, iPOD / MP3 players and cellular phones.”
The language above could not be more clear: not satisfied = full refund.
Here’s what I’d do, If I were in your sitch. with Costco:
Contact corporate; if you speak with a receptionist…ask her how her day is going, tell her that you would like to have a chat with the District Manager who over sees the ___(insert your Costco here)___ warehouse about your increasingly negative experience with the piano. You should get a call within 24 hours, the DM will probably satisfy you and you’ll intend to thank me, but you will forget all about me!! If after a reasonable discussion you find yourself still in possession of a piano, you then write a letter to ” W. Craig Jelinek – President and COO”, demanding that they honor their return policy because by not doing so they are in violation of several ca laws, such as provisions pertaining to unfair business practices, consumer protections contracts, etc. -RAN OUTTA ROOM!!!!
-continued- if you get no or a negative response from your letter then I’d sue them. Forget “class action” suits – they really only benefit the lawyers involved, and will have WAY too much out of pocket expense. I would file a breach of contract/tortuous business practices action against them as a pro per in Superior Court (a small claims suit will be fought by them, but a full civil trial will cost them substantially more that the piano is worth- and will result in a settlement in your favor)
Here’s a couple of direct numbers at Costco Corporate:
CONTACTS:
Costco Wholesale Corporation
Richard Galanti
425/313-8203
Bob Nelson
425/313-8255
Jeff Elliott
425/313-8264
Good luck from North Hollywood!
D
1) Your electric piano constitutes as a computer, and it is therefore completely valid for them to decline your return even barring what I’m about to continue with. Yes, under layman terms the computer is often just used to mean laptop or desktop, but technically computers are a far more vast category.
Their return policy was changed 3 years ago because unethical people like yourself kept abusing it, so now it doesn’t include electronics. Furthermore, what you are reading on the site isn’t necessarily the actual legally binding version, which simply uses the word electronics. Nor is it actually legally binding at all.
2) Even should it be legally binding (they honor it most of the time anyways, because it’s good business sense), it does not say you get a refund for any reason, it stipulates satisfaction. Not only is it easy to see that you did gain some satisfaction from it, but the term satisfaction itself is arbitrary.
And let’s make this clear right now… just because some employee said something doesn’t mean squat. Holy hell, some minimum paid worker didn’t know every specific little thing about the company… Often, it is the lower workers that first do things, and higher more knowledgeable review it to ensure it. You got an acceptance from a patsy, but the legal team revoked that. Also, it is no doubt that the original box most likely had the OS requirements on it when you bought it.
3) Ethics. With your constant comments denying any wrongdoing, I guess you don’t understand what ethics are. Ethics doesn’t mean, that just because you can do it, means you are ethical in doing it. Understand? You know your actions were unethical, but you saw financial gains and a win for yourself, your greed won over your ethics. You sat at the table and discussed it, but the answer was because you could do it it was right. No. No it is not. You keep trying to defend yourself, “Well, it’s THEIR fault that they have that policy…” It is not their fault for you trying to abuse their goodwill. That’s blaming the victim.
Consumers need to abide by a code of ethics too. Just because you have a right to do something doesn’t mean it’s right to do it.
I have gone through similar problems as you with an RO unit i have, (still), I purchased an RO unit from them a few years back, It started leaking 2 weeks ago, I looked at Costco.com they still stocked my unit, I checked the local store,(less then a 1/4 mile from my house), they did not have the one I had. I checked Home Depot down the street I had a new unit in the cart and was walking through the store, I called the Costco store and talked to the customer service/returns girl there. I asked if there was anything they could do, about it leaking, She told me that I could return it for a full refund and order the one online if I wanted. I told her it was at least 3-5 years old, she said it doesn’t matter as long as it was not more then 10 years. I was like really? She then said, and even if it has been more then 10 years it doesn’t mean if can’t be returned, it just means that a manager has to be involved. I left the unit in the cart at Home Depot and drove home. I ordered the new unit from Costco.com, (it arrived the next day) a week later after installing the new unit, we made our bi-weekly Costco run, I stopped at the returns desk and told the girl there what was wrong with it. She looked it up and found that it was 7 years old. I was like OK well I was told that was not a problem. She called an ass-istant manager and he looked at the paper work, I told him my story, he said he had to talk to some one. I waited 15 minutes for him to come back. He had been out on the floor and pulled a owners manual from the unit there, he showed me the manufactures warranty page, which stated 3 years. He then said you got 7 years from it. What do you want from me. I told him what does your Satisfaction Guarantee on the wall behind you mean then? The only reason I purchased the new one from them (which cost more then the Home Depot version) was they were replacing the faulty product, it was still working at the time I pulled it, it was just leaking, and was not repairable due to the design.
He then got loud and started berating me in front of me son and telling me that I had the audacity to bring some thing in to return it after I had used it for 7 years. I told him that the only reason I did was because HIS employee told me to, and that it was not a problem. I was LIVID. I have not done anything with it yet. It is still in the back of the car. I am thinking since looking into it and finding it is up to the individual stores, that I will call another store see what they say, there are 6 stores around me….
I am a member of Costco and have returned several items after more than a year. The last item, a tube type TV, was more than 5 years old. The manager was called and tried to pin me down on why I’m no longer satisfied, but he eventually gave me my refund. He specifically said that is wasn’t a lifetime warranty, but a satisfaction guarantee. I buy items from Costco because of their lifetime satisfaction guarantee. The company gets new members as a result of their advertising the lifetime satisfaction guarantee. Costco gets new members as a result of Consumer Report touting their guarantee. If it’s not a lifetime satisfaction or warranty then what is it? Unlike Sam’s Club, Costco does not provide extended warranties. When I buy an item from Sam’s, I often buy the extended warranty that Sam’s offers. My desire would be for a competing company to sue Costco for unfair business practice.
I read this posting because we are planning on taking our dyson back to costco after having it a little over two years. It broke and there is a 5 year manufacturer’s warranty. We spend at least 3,000 a year at costco and that’s without major purchases. We buy everything we can there because of their awesome return policy. I think this business knows what they are doing. They offer the return policy because it makes good business sense. The amount of things we’ve bought from them and never returned I think definitely makes up for what we’ve needed to return. This is exactly why we buy so much from them. They should definitely honor what they say and the 90 day stipulation on certain electronics help protect them from most people that would turn something back in just to get the latest model. If this company did do away with the return policy they would suffer because people like me wouldn’t buy from them as frequently.
Amazing thread, really. Who on earth would think that the clear, simple language of the Costco policy on returns was open to so much interpretation.
Satisfaction cannot be inferred by a customer having retained an item an unspecified amount of time. The behavior (of Costco) reported above is shocking, irrespective of the supposed ethical issues relating to this particular person’s motive for making a return. I am astonished to find so much opprobrium directed to the customer in this situation.
If a seller publishes a policy relating to return for refund, then it is the seller’s responsibility to adhere to it. That piano should go right back there.
First, LL Bean has an unlimited return policy, and I have never had an issue. I have returned items after many years, and customer service has never so much as batted an eye. The benefit to them is that I am a dedicated LL Bean customer for life, and I purchase significantly more than I return. Hammacher Schlemmer has a similar policy.
For Costco, my recommendation would be to bring the piano to a Costco store with your original receipt (if you still have it), and just tell them you want to return it. Don’t tell them the rest of your story, and don’t mention when you purchased it. If they decide to deny your return, just start complaining in a loud, irate manner. Be sure other shoppers can overhear you (but don’t make it too obvious that you’re trying to do that). Point out that the only reason why you shop at Costco rather than BJ’s or Sam’s Club is because of their return policy, etc.
The only reason why I would advocate this is because of the way they phrase their return policy. They know full well that people will be more likely to patronize their stores if they feel like they can return the merchandise at any time. Otherwise they would spell out the time limit for returns.
Some of the products of Costco and Sams club are discontinued ,overstock, products that didnt pass stringent qualitycontrol. If you look closely , They are items that dont sell at other stores. I am not saying that “ALL” products but majority of them. The other thing is that Costco,Sams,Home Depot, Lowes ,Walmarts ,etc,etc do not put up capital to purchase these items. 99% goods are on consignment. When merchandise sells the manufacture will get paid. Checks are sent out weekly. If it doesnt they will ask to be marked down. These companies also have to agree with the return policy. A lot of companies are refusing to refund after they agree to terms. Some companies are no longer open. Im sure Costco knows that some of the items are junk and had concience. Thats why you see it go on sell and doesnt come back to the store. Look at boxes, notice that they are always damaged, repackaged and didnt make the cut. Costco sold Honda lawnmowers with spiderwebbed aluminum engine blocks that were poorly casted . If a company wants to liquidate their shitty products they know Sams and Costco will be last resort “better buy it or you’ll never see it again”. They are dumping grounds for businesses.
I bought a small appliance (about $150) for a relative. It didn’t work and later found said appliance unused in their shed. Asked costco.com if I could return it (more than one year has gone by but not quite two) and the answer was NO! I think if they have a time limit, they should put it in writing. Instead they make people mistakenly think they have a long satisfaction guarantee. In my case the appliance is new-just not working. I think this is deception by Costco.
well its costcos fault for not incorporating a more thorough clearer policy, not the members that pay to shop there. the fact is that BESIDES certain items that can only bereturned within 90 days, there is NO i repeat there is NO restrictions on all of the other items. so therefore if i buy an air conditioner and 2 years from now im not satisfied i want my money back or an equal exchange. if you dont like it change your policy!! use your head people the company is shit and is too cheap and stupid to update their return policy, so if thats a member loophole so be it
It is amazing to me what people are willing to do to take advantage of a great company. Joseph, Costco does not sell “discontinued ,overstock, products that didnt pass stringent quality control”. Perhaps you should look into Costco products a little more closely before you post untrue information. Satisfaction Guaranteed is much different than a Lifetime Guarantee.
Costco Return Policy:
“How do I return an item?
For an immediate refund (including shipping and handling), Costco.com offers convenient returns at any one of our Costco warehouses worldwide. To expedite the return process, please have your order confirmation email with you. Click here to find the Costco warehouse closest to you.
If you are unable to return your order at one of our warehouses, please contact us at customer service or call our customer service center at 1-800-955-2292 for assistance. To expedite the processing of your return, please reference your order number.
We guarantee your satisfaction on every product we sell with a full refund. The following must be returned within 90 days of purchase for a refund: televisions, projectors, computers, cameras, camcorders, iPOD / MP3 players and cellular phones.”
At the beginning of your statement you said your son did not want the piano any longer….it had nothing to do with not being satisfied with your purchase. Interesting how you changed your story later on about not being compatible with your computer.
Today my local costco had just invented a new plant policy for 30 days. What a great company! Walmart doesn’t even look at my receipts at the exit.
Wow, do you really think Costco takes a hit when something is returned? They ship it back to the supplier at the suppliers expense and get a full refund for the item that THEY sold with a lifetime return policy. You would not believe the condition of things that people return things after years of satisfied use. Many go and buy a “new” version with their refund. Manufacturers go into this eyes open in the hope that volume makes up for return losses. Unfortunately, some find out two years later that they did not make a dime selling their products through Costco and may face a future, business closing loss.
It reminds me of the Credit card companies portraying themselves as heroes when you do not recognize a charge. They simply remove it from you bill, just like that with no questions. Guess what. The poor merchant is charged in full by the credit card company and in many cases has to wait weeks to get their money, even if the dispute is resolved. Some criminal types work this system for free merchandise. If they just keep disputing the charge, the merchant needs to put up $500.00 to have the situation looked at by a person. Who is going to risk that additional loss? The next time that you do not recognize a charge, take a minute to see if the charge was yours by calling the company on your card statement.
As far as ethics goes here, yeah they offer the policy but I could not return a worn out item with a clear conscience. Some folks have no concept of fairness.
Last month I purchased the “Smart For Life” two month supply cookie diet from costco.com for $199.99. You eat six cookies a day and then eat a small meal…protein and veggies and no fruit. I have been on the program and not losing anything despite following the porgram 100%. The cookies taste horrible, trust me, they do! I called costco and they said “bring it into the store”, which is a lot easier that shipping it back since I don’t have the box anymore. I told the CS rep I ate some of the product, but i really want to give it more time to work, albeit suffering with the taste!. he again said no problem.
I think if I would have bought this anywhere else I’d be out of luck.
So in about a weeks time, I’ll be shlepping this back to the store.
I tried to do this in high school with my laptop, you know what my mom said? “No, you will not return that laptop because you want a new one. You will use it till you can afford a new one because i will not be humiliated by you returning a laptop over a year old.” She explained why and I knew myself that it felt wrong so I saved up and sold the old one a few months later and bought a new one with the proceeds.
I think we’ve all returned something at costco one time or another that was a little too long after the purchase date. However, your piano case is a sheer abuse of the policy. They put that policy in place in case something really happens to the purchased item for ex. ps3 won’t eject game anymore after 8 months of use. I feel that would be a justifiable return but 2 years and after your son has gotten much use out of it? Why dont you be a parent and tell your son if your not happy with this one tough get a job and save for a new one instead of promoting the abuse of the policy. It is cases like this that made them change the lifetime return policy for everything to 90 days for electronics. Costco may have that policy plastered but they are hoping that their members aren’t a bunch of tricksters and swindlers
Costco is FALSELY advertising their return policy that it is a “lifetime” return policy. This is not true. This is false advertisement. I hope an attorney can chime in here because there should be a class action lawsuit about this.
I think if you take it to them they may have a different response.
I’ve filed a complaint with the FTC and in small claims court because Costco is not honoring their policy. I’ve bought 4 computers from them and have returned 5. Three crashed repeatedly and their tech support told me to return them and would not consistently read discs and 2 dropped in price within 30 days after I bought them and the Costco rep told me they couldn’t credit the difference but I could return the ‘old’ one and purchase a new one at the lower price. When I went to return the last one which would not read discs I was told that my purchase to return ratio was too high. Mind you all were returned within 90 days per the receipt. Costco is engaging in deceptive practices and failing to honor the contract we have with them. I totaled my amex bills for my 10 years as a Costco member and I’ve purchased in that time $231,584.92 and have credits of $11,725.22.
I’d would very much like to see a class action lawsuit against them. I had no problem when Costco changed their policy on some electronics, and I’ve honored my part of the agreement, but Costco has not and they will be punished if they fail to honor the agreement. I’ve also contacted my state attorney general and they’ve already contacted me back wanting additional details as they’ve had other complaints. One of their paralegals told me that if Costco is doing this, then they are violating state consumer protection laws and the potential fine can be $10,000 per incident. I’m ready to go out and buy 10 more laptops to return for them to tell me no just to get their fine over $100,000. Maybe that will get thru to someone to either publicly change their policy or truly honor it.
Totally not unethical. The return policy they state they need to enforced – not a different one. It just depends ont the tiny type.
false advertising… You can take them to court for that.
If costco says that to get people in the store they need to honor it. if not they are the ones acting unethically.
Costco is unethical to begin with. they take business away from local stores. that is why we don;t have any mom and pop shops around anymore and instead we have shitty costco and walmart and starbucks.
When i read these posts about what is unethical i have to say that they ar posted by people hired by the company to say these things. Big corporattions, and even little ones hire a team of people do google search the web for things that will hurt thier business. Then in the guise of regular consumers they post things talking about ehtics to bend public opinion. I know they do this because i used to work for a company who did this.
so ignore ost of these things. it is not unethical. Stop thinking about it. Just return shit whenever you want. I advise taking it to the store instead. they can;t say no to your face. i take back computers every 3 months.
I also enjoy ripping off bed bath an beyond. You buy something with a %20 off coupon and then take it back for store credit without a reciept. tell them you paid cash so they can;t look up your credit card. try to stick to the same product though and keep saying it is defective… when you change products it looks suspicious… Stick to mechanical things like blenders and stuff cause you can see when things are wrong with pans and such…
Another good one to rip off is REI. You can actually mail the returns in. after years of use.
i’m still trying to figure out how to get free coffee at starbucks.
but remember the rule is to Never never never rip off a moma nd pop shop.
take care and hope you just take teh piano in. Doit for the good of the country. Rip off these corporate chains to no end please. it i is not unethical. What is unethical is corporate personhood.
Agreed, totally not unethical. The return policy they state they need to enforce – not a different one. It just depends ont the tiny type.
If costco says that to get people in the store they need to honor it. if not they are the ones acting unethically.
Costco is unethical to begin with. they take business away from local stores. that is why we don;t have any mom and pop shops around anymore and instead we have shitty costco and walmart and starbucks.
When i read these posts about what is unethical i have to say that they ar posted by people hired by the company to say these things. Big corporattions, and even little ones hire a team of people do google search the web for things that will hurt thier business. Then in the guise of regular consumers they post things talking about ehtics to bend public opinion. I know they do this because i used to work for a company who did this.
so ignore ost of these things. it is not unethical. Stop thinking about it. Just return shit whenever you want. I advise taking it to the store instead. they can;t say no to your face. i take back computers every 3 months.
I also enjoy ripping off bed bath an beyond. You buy something with a %20 off coupon and then take it back for store credit without a reciept. tell them you paid cash so they can;t look up your credit card. try to stick to the same product though and keep saying it is defective… when you change products it looks suspicious… Stick to mechanical things like blenders and stuff cause you can see when things are wrong with pans and such…
Another good one to rip off is REI. You can actually mail the returns in. after years of use.
i’m still trying to figure out how to get free coffee at starbucks.
but remember the rule is to Never never never rip off a moma nd pop shop.
take care and hope you just take teh piano in. Doit for the good of the country. Rip off these corporate chains to no end please. it i is not unethical. What is unethical is corporate personhood.
I bought some GEF Flooring (Bamboo) from Costco. The flooring arrived here in Vancouver in damaged boxes. I contacted the manufacturer via email, no response. I called and they gave me the run around for a few months. They finally sent me the flooring but charged me for shipping…I installed remaining the flooring it cracked over the past 2 months. Tried to contact them again and they told me to go through their other online company floortarget.com? What the *** does that have to do with anything? The main company has 3 names, supexbond, mga group canada and golden elite wood floors. Probably to hide behind many aliases in order to avoid fixing a claim. I have consulted an attorney regarding my disastrous floors and the manufacturers negligence to acknowledge the problem. Stay away from this crap!” – Doorknob Ilia Orkin
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